Is this an installation bug? 
Or basesystem? 
Or network?

(In reply to comment #1)
> Is this an installation bug? 
> Or basesystem? 
> Or network?
> 
I am not sure if I understand your question? I wanted to add networkmanager-vpnc after I installed system. So this was network installation from suse server repositories. OS was installed from DVD.

Two package managers: smart and Yast require to install all this software. So these dependencies really exist, but absolutely make no sense.

The problem with those GNOME deps is known, installing certain packages causes Gnome to be installed almost completely :( Though I'm not sure what can be done about it. Reassigning to the Gnome team.

There are gui elements in Networkmanager-vpnc that are not yet replicated in Knetworkmanager so thats why gnome is pulled in.

This is not a bug.

Native KDE bits for the VPN stuff is not likely to get in for 10.1.

Adjusting summary and severity.  Moving to 10.2.

Also changing component to KDE.

my response got lost in the air. So I will try again :)

I did --nodeps -force installation of NetworkManager-vpnc
And I am happily using NetworkManager-vpnc (now writing this message). This works well. It also confirms my suspicion that most of these dependencies are not real. Even if KDE does not provide own cisco/open vpn applet, suse is a complete distro. This means (for me) that within software selection provided by suse I can install all that I need... without excess luggage.
For networkManager-vpnc i need a bunch of libraries. That is all (as it is proven by successful installation of working piece of the software).

So argument that half of gnome is required seems to be incorrect:
to install suse NetworkManager I need:
NetworkManager (installed already)
libICE.so.6
libORBit-2.so.0
libOBitCosNaming-2.so.0
libSM.so.6
libX11.so.6
libXext.so.6

and so on. 

No real requirement for gstreamer (???) or gnome-desktop which absolutely have no value  for vpn setup.

Even if this is gnome applet (RH), provided dependencies in suse still are incorrect.

What I am suggesting is that installation of (in my case) NetworkManager-vpnc should only install required libraries, not whole DE. It may be that someone using Gnome would like to install k3b. Does this means that he has to install whole KDE or only libraries really required?

Moreover the fact that I Installed NetworkManager-vpnc without 

control-center2
evolution-data-server
gnome-panel
gstreamer010
gstreamer010-plugins-base
libbeagle
metacity
nautilus

indicates that this is simple problem not requiring new KDE applet for vpn and whole new version od opensuse.

Thank you very much for all your responses.

NetworkManager-vpnc requires NetworkManager-gnome as this package provides the generic GUI code for VPN.  This dependency is correct.

For everything else being pulled -- starting in the dependency chain from NetworkManager-gnome -- I have no idea whether the dependencies are correct.

JP, could you please pass this to someone how knows?

(Reverting some of my previously made changes to this bug)

I don't have NetworkManager-gnome installed


before NetworkManager-vpnc installation, knetworkmanager did not provide vpn option, after networkmanager-vpnc installation, Knetworkmanager does provide vpn option (at least partially making possible to setup vpn). Missing part is a window asking for the username and password which I am providing in terminal window.

This is also my request (if possible) to make installation of the software easier without extra components that really do not help but make OS maintaining more complicated.

(In reply to comment #9)

> before NetworkManager-vpnc installation, knetworkmanager did not provide vpn
> option, after networkmanager-vpnc installation, Knetworkmanager does provide
> vpn option (at least partially making possible to setup vpn). Missing part is a
> window asking for the username and password which I am providing in terminal
> window.

Exactly this is what NetworkManager-gnome provides. This is the generic code provided by NetworkManager-gnome for all NetworkManager VPN modules.
 
> This is also my request (if possible) to make installation of the software
> easier without extra components that really do not help but make OS maintaining
> more complicated.

But actually it is required if you want to get the authentication dialog.

I understand what networkmanager-gnome provides, but I don't see a point of installing, nautilus and the rest of the software "required". I will gladly install NetworkManager-gnome but it seems ridiculous that the best choice is to install everything otherwise something will not work. 

I had similar problem with SLED installation: disabling during installation OpenOffice will automatically disable Novell Desktop which in consequnce will disable whole DE!
We can reverse it. KDE does not require Novell Desktop. Open office does not require neither KDE nor Novell Desktop. So this is dependency created by SLED team. This is only an example of really bad software design (I don't expect opensuse to fix SLED mistakes obviously)

I think that this is madness.

If someone is using blackbox, he will have to install whole Gnome or/and KDE of he would like to use gnome/kde apps. 

My understanding is that any distro is taking care of all dependencies proper way. Suse provides both Gnome and Kde with all libraries, so if one is using gnome and wants to install KDE app, installer should pull out from repositories only required stuff. Not everything.

I don't know how to explain this: in short installing whole DE to get one app is  really not a good option.

I hope that this does not sound aggressive. I am only trying to explaing some of the issues from user's stand point.

I'm not disagreeing with your view on having to install so much, however sometimes it may not always be avoidable:

1. These dependencies are not "fake" they are generated for the most part automatically based on how libraries are linked and can include indirect items.  

NetworkManager-vpnc depends on NetworkManager-gnome because of bug 158326.  NetworkManager-gnome pulls in gnome-panel because it links to the applet library and gnome-panel depends on control-center2 because the panel launches it from the menus.

2. OpenOffice is not a dependency of anything in SLED, from out build system that tracks deps for all 5000+ packages:

jpr@macintyre:~> whatdependson OpenOffice_org
- beagle-index (gnome-maintainers@suse.de)
  maintainers: gnome-maintainers@suse.de

and beagle-index is only a build time dependency, not an install time dep.  I'm not sure what you mean by "Novell Desktop is disabled" above.

3. The installer does only pull out whats required based on dependencies.


libpanel-applet could be split out from gnome-panel and that might solve this specific chain (CC'ing Joe H. to look into that).

Main solution is to have knetworkmanager not need the GNOME ui at all for VPN config.

(In reply to comment #11)
> I understand what networkmanager-gnome provides, but I don't see a point of
> installing, nautilus and the rest of the software "required". I will gladly
> install NetworkManager-gnome but it seems ridiculous that the best choice is to
> install everything otherwise something will not work. 
> 
> I had similar problem with SLED installation: disabling during installation
> OpenOffice will automatically disable Novell Desktop which in consequnce will
> disable whole DE!
> We can reverse it. KDE does not require Novell Desktop. Open office does not
> require neither KDE nor Novell Desktop. So this is dependency created by SLED
> team. This is only an example of really bad software design (I don't expect
> opensuse to fix SLED mistakes obviously)
> 
> I think that this is madness.
> 
> If someone is using blackbox, he will have to install whole Gnome or/and KDE of
> he would like to use gnome/kde apps. 
> 
> My understanding is that any distro is taking care of all dependencies proper
> way. Suse provides both Gnome and Kde with all libraries, so if one is using
> gnome and wants to install KDE app, installer should pull out from repositories
> only required stuff. Not everything.
> 
> I don't know how to explain this: in short installing whole DE to get one app
> is  really not a good option.
> 
> I hope that this does not sound aggressive. I am only trying to explaing some
> of the issues from user's stand point.
> 


of course openoffice should not be linked to anything KDE
But try to select KDE as default GUI and then deselect OO.org. I tried this twice. I got a warning that this (deselecting OO.org) will deselect Novell Desktop applet. I did not care much about Novell applet. But this also deselected whole KDE.

For vpnc try Kvpnc. Maybe this will be helpful 

also this discussion may help:
http://mail.kde.org/pipermail/kde-networkmanager/2006-June/000005.html

Kvpnc:
http://home.gna.org/kvpnc/en/index.html

Helmut is currently working on getting rid of the KNetworkManager dependency on NetworkManager-gnome for the VPN modules.

This will cause some splits of the NetworkManager VPN packages as they currently include the necessary GNOME bits.

-> OS10.2

Adjusting Summary.

→ openSUSE 10.3

Just checked in the necessary packages to avoid the gnome dependencies.

*** Bug 292207 has been marked as a duplicate of this bug. ***